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Serenity Steele
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Posted - 2008.10.05 15:28:00 -
[1]
I'm sure I'll need a flame ******ant suit for this, however it's a pretty simply Issue;
If CSMs are banned from the forums or banned from EVE, they should be removed from the CSM immediately. This should be the case for both Temporary and Permanent bans.
The issue I can see with this is that it provides CCP with a mechanism for removing CSM members, so it would need to be documented that the person in question has received warnings first, and notified to the whole CSM that this is occuring.
On the other hand - do you really want someone who gets banned representing you?
Note: The situation of what happens when a CSM member gets removed is already dealt with: An Alternate is raised up in their place, in order of max votes received
Vote!
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Serenity Steele
Dynamic Data Distribution
Ministry of Information
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Posted - 2008.10.06 18:07:00 -
[2]
 Originally by: fuze
You are kidding right? Ever heard of conflict of interest?
If a CSM member is banned from the game/forums the CSM itself should decide among themselves about the fate of their fellow member.
No, not kidding. Yes, I've heard of conflict of interest.
I agree that the CSM itself should decide the fate of their fellow member, however this is problematic, as it means a faction in power can totally kick-out all other votes in CSM-members.
So based on the comments so far, I'll revise the ejection process like this;
Forum banning gives the CSM members the right to vote on whether the forum banned CSM member is kicked from the CSM. One vote may be taken per forum banning.
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Serenity Steele
Dynamic Data Distribution
Ministry of Information
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Posted - 2008.10.09 02:33:00 -
[3]
Well I'm glad this is a contentious topic :) Always more interesting debate.
Darius' point about the CSM not having influence over the Forum Mods is correct AFAIK, but that doesn't stop the CSM being given the ability to take action on forum bannings.
The interesting risk (again by Darius) is that a majority council could effectively "war-report" a fellow-CSM member they wanted kicked out (think thread-nought with reports); At the risk being forum banned themselves for repeatedly reporting posts that didn't deserve it. However that would be a neutral action, as the "war-reporting" majority wouldn't vote one of their own out of the Council.
On the otherhand, the "war-reporting" CSM would also be unable to communicate (or) do further reports.
The only way I can think to counter that is to simply remove a banned persons right to vote, and let alternates step up. As Alternates are sequential, this can also be gamed. Ideas?
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Serenity Steele
Dynamic Data Distribution
Ministry of Information
|
Posted - 2008.10.14 18:43:00 -
[4]
Edited by: Serenity Steele on 14/10/2008 18:45:10
Originally by: Goumindong
Everyone is well aware of the potential drawbacks. That is why we keep asking "what is the problem in the first place?" that needs to be resolved
What is the problem that needs to be fixed?
btw, this isn't a fact. Guidelines are provided here for interacting with other members of the community (applies only on E-O ofc.)
The the problem that needs to be fixed is there is no way to repair a disfunctional council/members that cannot work together in a civilized way to identify, analyze and promote the issues effecting EVE Players.
I would define a disfunctional council/members as those that spend the majority of their time having non-eve related arguments about their respective characters to the point of abuse.
Forum bans are an indicator of this problem. There are many others seen at the start of the first CSM, where a lot of that energy could be directed to helping EVE, and had no actual benefit to the purpose of the CSM what-so-ever.
In regards to "Not everything has to have a benefit to the purpose of the CSM, the CSM are only human" argument belittles the humans who are capable of getting down to business. Are they sub-human? I don't think so, I think they're fit for purpose.
Unfortunately the nature of "internet space games" and lack of real-world or real-consequences for being unsuitable for position of responsibility mean that there is no existing (please someone think of one) way for vetting player appropriately with an election.
In RL there are multiple-elections before making it to the top, but in EVE's election system this isn't currently the case; which gives a high risk for people poorly suited to the job IMHO.
Edit: Thought of a potential sub-filter - if the forums actually had the "rate this post" system and you could chose to filter out low-rated posts, then there would be less voice for CSM candidates who really weren't fit for purpose.
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